HB 148 takes nothing away from public schools. Public schools currently receive 100% of the state income tax revenue.
The only way to increase funding for public school education is increase the State Income Tax rate, decrease or remove deductions for large families, or lower the number of kids in the classroom.
I want you Rob and the Teacher Union's who you represent explain exactly how they plan on improving Public Education by defeating Referendum 1?
The status quo changes nothing for our kids, so help me out here?
If I may, public schools are owned by the public. Taxpayers pay the salaries of school employees and pay for the buildings and everything included. Public schools are our property.
Do we want to teach our children if you don't like an aspect of what you own to abandon it? Do we teach our children if your mom doesn't like one annoying habit of your dad she can divorce him and find someone better?
We taxpayers need to take care of our belongings and relationships by investing in our schools to provide for our children the education we want for them. Threatening to leave if things don't go our way is not an admirable way to create change.
Status quo is far better than changing with a solution that is not proven to solve the problem and will most likely worsen the status quo.
Not to mention that the tax money to pay for vouchers comes from the general fund... which is used to pay state employee salaries, and a billion other services.
I'm worried that this two-tier education system is going to cost the taxpayers more money over the long haul. I thought responsible government was for lower taxes... not more of them.
I have done research on both sides, I am a teacher, I am a member of the teacher's union. With all of that said, I am leaning toward voting FOR Ref.1 one thing I like is that when a student goes to a private school only up to 3,000 dollars goes with them. The rest of that money stays in the school district. That means the districts get at least 4,500 dollars for a student that is not there. I was also worried that teachers in private sectors would not be kept to the same standard as public teachers. I notices in the bill teachers are required to have bachelors degrees or higher, or other specialized training. I don't care if they go through a teacher certification program, it's really just jumping through loopholes. Secondly, I have always been against school districts monopolizing education. When there is competition there is improvement. Look at all of the socialistic governments that control not only education but everything else. I continue to look into both sides of the situation, I have an open mind and I probably will not make a final decsision until a couple of days before, becuase I want to make sure I am informed and making the correct choice for me and my family.
I don't have a google account so had to sign on as anomynous but my name is TJ
This is just another tax credit for the rich. If you can afford private school right now, your kids would be there. $3,000 isn't going to help anyone. And let's say they get the credit? The private school doesn't have to accept them. IF you aren't happy with the system, make changes and help your school. Don't take any more money from them.
many people here don't seem to know Math very well(maybe they went through our public schools ) because mathmaticly/financially referendum 1 is great for public schools!! for every student that goes to private the school has 1 less student but still gets $4000-$7000 of the money for the student that left(seems unfair to student not school)
the money being used is not taken from other uses(it is already going to some school) it should go to where the kid it is intended for is(also R1 only moves part of intended money).
I just recently got out of our public school system, so I have some experience of how it is , and it is not meeting up to what it is supposed to do. I had overcrowded classes, not enough text books in some, and in my opinion mismanagement of money (not enough books in some classes, but spend over half a million$ to fix a football field wow that helps education) along with those problems many of my classes had poor quality teaching and/or did not progress very well or fast.
LET THERE BE OTHER CHOICES AND OPTIONS (freedom=choice) dont limit those who want other options that may be better for them individually.
Help students not a (failing)system Vote YES!!!! for referendum 1 -Gard1
ps. to others above: -yes acually 3k or even less can help some (with it I would have been able to) not all private schools are very expensive -"Do you think he will actually make it to Heaven?" speaking of such topics is there not something like "judge not that ye be not judged" who are you to judge him?
Please note our child reads and writes on a 4th grade level and he is in the 7th Grade. He has 2 incompletes in 7th Grade History and 7th Grade Science. To: Mr. and Mrs,
This is ******, ***** RESOURCE teacher. I have **** for both Reading and English.I enjoyed meeting ** ******* at PTC and going over ****** progress. At that time we reviewed the need for **** to be on progress reports so we could all monitor his daily success and the homework he has to do. (if any.) It is my professional opinion, that ******is able to do the work at our school. **** scored a low 4th grade reading level. All the teachers here are success oriented and allow ALL our students:
1-extended time on all assignments 2-to retake tests and all assignments until they do succeed within the 1st 2 terms. 3- A 30 minute homework class from 7:50-8:25 do work on missing assignments. 4-We give no F's...only incompletes the 1st 2 terms. They may make up all incompletes. We strive to help our students every and any way we can. They though, must walk through the door to get this assistance. This unique setting allows resource and mainstream students to succeed at all levels, regardless of their abilities. Students have a homework club that they can attend each evening and Friday school (12:40-3:00). All 7th graders have homework from time to time and need to work it into their afternoon and evening hours. I emailed you ** days ago because of **** behaviors. I know he is ADHA. (Parent inserted: has ADHD) I believe his behaviors are "choice" and not a result of his ADHA. (Parent inserted: ADHD) ******** has made some poor choices. I gave him one of my progress reports, which he ****** for ***** days. The day after he was on the progress reports, he did "VERY WELL" each teacher reported excellence in grades, effort and behaviors. Today, he did not bring around a progress report. I am hoping that ***** will continue to use the progress reports so that we can report to you daily. The term ends on Oct. 25th. ***** has sufficient time to make up all his work. ***** can attend the homework club each evening or step in to ***** or my class each night at 2:45. We are here each evening after school hours to assist any of our students. ****** is his ****** teacher. She has him for math.
(After meeting response by parent but before the above response)
We will be looking forward to your plan of action that will impact ***** before any of his other grades get bad. He already has the problems that are attached to this email. It is very important to us that he does not feel lesser of a person because the fact that he can not get the grades that are out of his reach. He is a child that feeds on approve. (Parent inserted after approval) I hope at some point he can complete his work in his classes so he feels as if he belongs in our school.
Thank you for your efforts in advance,
As you can see this is now year 3 with trying to get my child a education not Maistreamed by a public school. So I Vote Yes for Referendum 1!!!
One way to sort through false information is to look closely at where the money goes and who has more to lose or gain by where the money goes.
Public school, as it would appear, have a lot to lose if Referendum 1 gets passed. So does the teacher's union.
Private schools stand to benefit from vouchers in that more parents will be able to afford private schools.
But who has the most to lose or gain? I say public schools and their unions have more to lose than private schools have to gain.
Private schools will still have to compete for every student that chooses to exit the public school system. They will have to raise their standards of operation in order to avoid becoming obsolete. They will have to hire more teachers and facilitate more students. It is not a windfall for private schools; if anything it will test private schools.
Public schools lose a meal ticket with each kid that leaves. Unions lose their power, school boards and faculty are downsized, and the state government that supports public schools, in essence, says,"You are not getting the job done, we will no longer punish our children for your short-comings." Public schools do not need to compete to keep their meal tickets if referendum 1 is not passed. A monopoly they are currently reaping the benefits of.
I graduated from a public school in California. I graduated from a private university in Utah. My wife and I are now starting a family and we ask ourselves questions like, "Where will our kids go to school?"
My wife is a graduate of Utah public schools and Utah public university drop out. She is absolutely certain that her educational short-comings are the result of the short-comings of the Utah public educational system.
She and I are absolutely certain that our children WILL receive the highest level of education and the best chance to succeed in life if they attend private schools. If the state is truly invested in helping its future, its children, succeed, the state will vote for vouchers.
If there is anyone reading who is still a fence-sitter, I have posted arugments on both sides in a comparable format. To see point-by-point comparision, visit http://faircompare.googlepages.com/home
For all those who are saying that "public schools fail our children" "they lack quality education" "my child is in 7th grade with a 4th grade reading level":
I went through public school. I love dthe social aspect of it. Fortunately I had PARENTS who emphasised the importance of education. My PARENTS read with me at nights and helped me with homework. I didn't need to go to extra study sessions because my PARENTS helped me. When I graduated from high school, I started college with 22 credits (just under 2 semesters worth). Not only did I get the social aspect with kids living around me, I took advantage of the great learning environment. I actually was able to help those who were struggling and that helped me improve. Public schools are a great environment for children to learn in. Not only education, but life skills.
Maybe instead of saying "I send my kids to a school that doesn't teach them anything" you should be saying "My kids come home to a house that doesn't support their education."
Stop complaining about how aweful the school system is and take more time with your children to teach them.
First of all, Ladies and Gentlemen, this ad is nothing but propaganda. Thus far, the people who are telling the public to vote against referendum one because of 'loopholes' have not actually revealed what the loopholes are. The only truth in this is that the teacher was a teacher of the year. There will be smaller classes and more resources per student if this gets passed. More money goes to the Public School that a kid comes from than the Private school that he/she goes to- In fact, as it is the districts and schools are losing money because those that can afford it are moving their kids anyway, and those that can't are switching to charter schools or home schools, and that makes the funding stop. Next, how the money is budgeted and used is up to the districts, not by the senators. Evidence of this was the Jordan District's 300% pay raise to their superintendent and district board. Another is the Alpine districts refusal to sell Lehi High Schools land to the city, when it costs more to maintain the school than to build a new one; in addition, they are trying to expand when there isn't space and they are in a traffic zone. Problem? Yes. Is it the state's fault? No. The districts need to take accountability for their budgets. Finally, Referendum One will only HELP families. It requires the teachers in the public and private schools to be better, because now those people who's kids need more help or a better environment have a CHOICE in where their kids go. This means that the districts can no longer cater to the Middle of the Road students- they will have to raise all of their students in a better standard or lose the kids that they still have. Plus, if it IS a matter of money, after alot of the kids leave they'll have money oozing out their ears. I don't see a downside yet. In conclusion, Referendum one is the only solution to solve the problem of mediocrity and below-the-bar standards in Utah. We are now in an age where Knowledge and Life Skills are easier to gain than ever- it's time for us to start taking advantage of it.
The second point that I want to make is that we want to teach our kids to be good people and upstanding citizens above everything else, correct? This country was founded upon the principle of 'if there's something wrong with the way your country is being run, change it' in layman's terms. It is the duty of the people to 'throw off such governments as is necessary' to achieve a better government. Finally, if you don't want to believe that it's the governments fault, I agree. The accountability of taking care of the students falls to the districts, not the Gov't. Finally, if you don't want your children to cheat their way to the White house, give them an opportunity to become smarter than their opponents by giving them the best schooling possible. If you are not willing to help all of Utah in the process, move to a better state, or D.C. if you are so concerned about how you aren't in charge. take accountability for your actions before pushing it onto someone else, no matter how much they may or may not deserve it. I'll keep up to date, so please present me with your views. VOTE FOR REFERENDUM 1!
To address the anonymous comment stating "who are you to judge him" about George W. Bush...Everone in this country has the god given right to judge him being that he is running our country. Every poor decision he has made that affect the lives of our citizens gives the people the right to judge him. That is supposed to come along with the responsibility of being president of the United States.
Why should I support the changes referendum 1 imposes to advance the idea of private schooling. I believe in public schooling because as an anonymous person has already suggested above,it is the parents who need to become more involved with students not the school systems.
16 comments:
Total Lies.
HB 148 takes nothing away from public schools. Public schools currently receive 100% of the state income tax revenue.
The only way to increase funding for public school education is increase the State Income Tax rate, decrease or remove deductions for large families, or lower the number of kids in the classroom.
I want you Rob and the Teacher Union's who you represent explain exactly how they plan on improving Public Education by defeating Referendum 1?
The status quo changes nothing for our kids, so help me out here?
Cameron:
He, George Bush never beat smarter men then him, to get to the White House.
He used "Secret Combinations" to get to the white house.
Do you think he will actually make it to Heaven?
"Our children,S are learning."
Bush was educated in the private sector!
That's why vouchers won't work.
I don't want my children to grow up cheating their way to the white house, like he did.
If I may, public schools are owned by the public. Taxpayers pay the salaries of school employees and pay for the buildings and everything included. Public schools are our property.
Do we want to teach our children if you don't like an aspect of what you own to abandon it? Do we teach our children if your mom doesn't like one annoying habit of your dad she can divorce him and find someone better?
We taxpayers need to take care of our belongings and relationships by investing in our schools to provide for our children the education we want for them. Threatening to leave if things don't go our way is not an admirable way to create change.
Status quo is far better than changing with a solution that is not proven to solve the problem and will most likely worsen the status quo.
Not to mention that the tax money to pay for vouchers comes from the general fund... which is used to pay state employee salaries, and a billion other services.
I'm worried that this two-tier education system is going to cost the taxpayers more money over the long haul. I thought responsible government was for lower taxes... not more of them.
Since when did Rob start representing the UEA?
Rob, did you get a new job and forget to tell me?
< wink >
I have done research on both sides, I am a teacher, I am a member of the teacher's union. With all of that said, I am leaning toward voting FOR Ref.1 one thing I like is that when a student goes to a private school only up to 3,000 dollars goes with them. The rest of that money stays in the school district. That means the districts get at least 4,500 dollars for a student that is not there. I was also worried that teachers in private sectors would not be kept to the same standard as public teachers. I notices in the bill teachers are required to have bachelors degrees or higher, or other specialized training. I don't care if they go through a teacher certification program, it's really just jumping through loopholes. Secondly, I have always been against school districts monopolizing education. When there is competition there is improvement. Look at all of the socialistic governments that control not only education but everything else. I continue to look into both sides of the situation, I have an open mind and I probably will not make a final decsision until a couple of days before, becuase I want to make sure I am informed and making the correct choice for me and my family.
I don't have a google account so had to sign on as anomynous but my name is TJ
This is just another tax credit for the rich. If you can afford private school right now, your kids would be there. $3,000 isn't going to help anyone. And let's say they get the credit? The private school doesn't have to accept them. IF you aren't happy with the system, make changes and help your school. Don't take any more money from them.
many people here don't seem to know Math very well(maybe they went through our public schools )
because mathmaticly/financially referendum 1 is great for public schools!! for every student that goes to private the school has 1 less student but still gets $4000-$7000 of the money for the student that left(seems unfair to student not school)
the money being used is not taken from other uses(it is already going to some school) it should go to where the kid it is intended for is(also R1 only moves part of intended money).
I just recently got out of our public school system, so I have some experience of how it is , and it is not meeting up to what it is supposed to do. I had overcrowded classes, not enough text books in some, and in my opinion mismanagement of money (not enough books in some classes, but spend over half a million$ to fix a football field wow that helps education)
along with those problems many of my classes had poor quality teaching and/or did not progress very well or fast.
LET THERE BE OTHER CHOICES AND OPTIONS (freedom=choice) dont limit those who want other options that may be better for them individually.
Help students not a (failing)system
Vote YES!!!! for referendum 1
-Gard1
ps. to others above:
-yes acually 3k or even less can help some (with it I would have been able to) not all private schools are very expensive
-"Do you think he will actually make it to Heaven?"
speaking of such topics is there not something like "judge not that ye be not judged" who are you to judge him?
Please note our child reads and writes on a 4th grade level and he is in the 7th
Grade. He has 2 incompletes in 7th Grade History and 7th Grade Science.
To: Mr. and Mrs,
This is ******, ***** RESOURCE teacher. I have **** for both Reading and English.I enjoyed meeting ** ******* at PTC and going over ****** progress. At that time we reviewed the need for **** to be on progress reports so we could all monitor his daily success and the homework he has to do. (if any.) It is my professional opinion, that ******is able to do the work at our school. **** scored a low 4th grade reading level.
All the teachers here are success oriented and allow ALL our students:
1-extended time on all assignments
2-to retake tests and all assignments until they do succeed within the 1st 2 terms.
3- A 30 minute homework class from 7:50-8:25 do work on missing assignments.
4-We give no F's...only incompletes the 1st 2 terms. They may make up all incompletes. We strive to help our students every and any way we can. They though, must walk through the door to get this assistance. This unique setting allows resource and mainstream students to succeed at all levels, regardless of their abilities. Students have a homework club that they can attend each evening and Friday school (12:40-3:00). All 7th graders have homework from time to time and need to work it into their afternoon and evening hours. I emailed you ** days ago because of **** behaviors. I know he is ADHA. (Parent inserted: has ADHD) I believe his behaviors are "choice" and not a result of his ADHA. (Parent inserted: ADHD) ******** has made some poor choices. I gave him one of my progress reports, which he ****** for ***** days. The day after he was on the progress reports, he did "VERY
WELL" each teacher reported excellence in grades, effort and behaviors. Today, he did not bring around a progress report. I am hoping that ***** will continue to use the progress reports so that we can report to you daily.
The term ends on Oct. 25th. ***** has sufficient time to make up all his work. ***** can attend the homework club each evening or step in to ***** or my class each night at 2:45. We are here each evening after school hours to
assist any of our students. ****** is his ****** teacher. She has him for math.
(After meeting response by parent but before the above response)
We will be looking forward to your plan of action that will impact ***** before any of his other grades get bad. He already has the problems that are attached to this email. It is very important to us that he does not feel lesser of a person because the fact that he can not get the grades that are out of his reach. He is a child that feeds on approve. (Parent inserted after approval) I hope at some point he can complete his work in his classes so he feels as if he belongs in our school.
Thank you for your efforts in advance,
As you can see this is now year 3 with trying to get my child a education not Maistreamed by a public school. So I Vote Yes for
Referendum 1!!!
One way to sort through false information is to look closely at where the money goes and who has more to lose or gain by where the money goes.
Public school, as it would appear, have a lot to lose if Referendum 1 gets passed. So does the teacher's union.
Private schools stand to benefit from vouchers in that more parents will be able to afford private schools.
But who has the most to lose or gain? I say public schools and their unions have more to lose than private schools have to gain.
Private schools will still have to compete for every student that chooses to exit the public school system. They will have to raise their standards of operation in order to avoid becoming obsolete. They will have to hire more teachers and facilitate more students. It is not a windfall for private schools; if anything it will test private schools.
Public schools lose a meal ticket with each kid that leaves. Unions lose their power, school boards and faculty are downsized, and the state government that supports public schools, in essence, says,"You are not getting the job done, we will no longer punish our children for your short-comings." Public schools do not need to compete to keep their meal tickets if referendum 1 is not passed. A monopoly they are currently reaping the benefits of.
I graduated from a public school in California. I graduated from a private university in Utah. My wife and I are now starting a family and we ask ourselves questions like, "Where will our kids go to school?"
My wife is a graduate of Utah public schools and Utah public university drop out. She is absolutely certain that her educational short-comings are the result of the short-comings of the Utah public educational system.
She and I are absolutely certain that our children WILL receive the highest level of education and the best chance to succeed in life if they attend private schools. If the state is truly invested in helping its future, its children, succeed, the state will vote for vouchers.
If there is anyone reading who is still a fence-sitter, I have posted arugments on both sides in a comparable format. To see point-by-point comparision, visit
http://faircompare.googlepages.com/home
For all those who are saying that "public schools fail our children" "they lack quality education" "my child is in 7th grade with a 4th grade reading level":
I went through public school. I love dthe social aspect of it. Fortunately I had PARENTS who emphasised the importance of education. My PARENTS read with me at nights and helped me with homework. I didn't need to go to extra study sessions because my PARENTS helped me.
When I graduated from high school, I started college with 22 credits (just under 2 semesters worth). Not only did I get the social aspect with kids living around me, I took advantage of the great learning environment. I actually was able to help those who were struggling and that helped me improve. Public schools are a great environment for children to learn in. Not only education, but life skills.
Maybe instead of saying "I send my kids to a school that doesn't teach them anything" you should be saying "My kids come home to a house that doesn't support their education."
Stop complaining about how aweful the school system is and take more time with your children to teach them.
Steven
First of all, Ladies and Gentlemen, this ad is nothing but propaganda. Thus far, the people who are telling the public to vote against referendum one because of 'loopholes' have not actually revealed what the loopholes are.
The only truth in this is that the teacher was a teacher of the year.
There will be smaller classes and more resources per student if this gets passed. More money goes to the Public School that a kid comes from than the Private school that he/she goes to- In fact, as it is the districts and schools are losing money because those that can afford it are moving their kids anyway, and those that can't are switching to charter schools or home schools, and that makes the funding stop.
Next, how the money is budgeted and used is up to the districts, not by the senators. Evidence of this was the Jordan District's 300% pay raise to their superintendent and district board. Another is the Alpine districts refusal to sell Lehi High Schools land to the city, when it costs more to maintain the school than to build a new one; in addition, they are trying to expand when there isn't space and they are in a traffic zone. Problem? Yes. Is it the state's fault? No. The districts need to take accountability for their budgets.
Finally, Referendum One will only HELP families. It requires the teachers in the public and private schools to be better, because now those people who's kids need more help or a better environment have a CHOICE in where their kids go. This means that the districts can no longer cater to the Middle of the Road students- they will have to raise all of their students in a better standard or lose the kids that they still have. Plus, if it IS a matter of money, after alot of the kids leave they'll have money oozing out their ears. I don't see a downside yet.
In conclusion, Referendum one is the only solution to solve the problem of mediocrity and below-the-bar standards in Utah. We are now in an age where Knowledge and Life Skills are easier to gain than ever- it's time for us to start taking advantage of it.
The second point that I want to make is that we want to teach our kids to be good people and upstanding citizens above everything else, correct? This country was founded upon the principle of 'if there's something wrong with the way your country is being run, change it' in layman's terms. It is the duty of the people to 'throw off such governments as is necessary' to achieve a better government. Finally, if you don't want to believe that it's the governments fault, I agree. The accountability of taking care of the students falls to the districts, not the Gov't.
Finally, if you don't want your children to cheat their way to the White house, give them an opportunity to become smarter than their opponents by giving them the best schooling possible. If you are not willing to help all of Utah in the process, move to a better state, or D.C. if you are so concerned about how you aren't in charge. take accountability for your actions before pushing it onto someone else, no matter how much they may or may not deserve it.
I'll keep up to date, so please present me with your views.
VOTE FOR REFERENDUM 1!
Here is great response to the oreo ad: The REAL oreo voucher ad
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8Kt-i4pmV0)
To address the anonymous comment stating "who are you to judge him" about George W. Bush...Everone in this country has the god given right to judge him being that he is running our country. Every poor decision he has made that affect the lives of our citizens gives the people the right to judge him. That is supposed to come along with the responsibility of being president of the United States.
Why should I support the changes referendum 1 imposes to advance the idea of private schooling. I believe in public schooling because as an anonymous person has already suggested above,it is the parents who need to become more involved with students not the school systems.
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